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Post by themodernwargamer on Aug 6, 2022 7:31:40 GMT
I had been looking for some rules to game “Cold War Gone Hot” in the eighties along the lines of Tom Clancy’s Red Storm Rising and picked up Missile Treat after it was recommended to me by a friend and it looks like it covers exactly what I am looking for.
However, after my initial read through I do have a couple of observations/questions:
F-4G Wild Weasel 1. Should this still have a cannon as my research indicates that the cannon was replaced by the RWR? 2. I note that the F-4G, and F-4E, for that matter have improved radar, both range and the addition of TWS, in the Gulf War list. From what year would those updates be common? My own research so far only indicates that F-4s received updates at some point in the eighties.
F-111 Aardvark What stats would you give the various updated versions of this aircraft? It is also one that should probably be included in the Gulf War list as I believe they “killed” more tanks than the A-10s did!
Thanks
Peter
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Post by NKL AeroTom on Aug 7, 2022 0:51:59 GMT
Hi Peter, glad you found the rules! sounds like a cool idea for a game. Looks like you're right with the F-4G - no cannon there, you can just play it as having no cannon, and reduce the points value by 5 points. The later F-4 variants are based on the CMANO database data (which I find very useful for a rough guide to radar ranges), it looks like all F-4Gs have the same radar range, of 111km, through the late 1970s to 1990. This translates to 24" in game terms (using the radar formula on page 134), although it's a bit odd that they have more range than an F-16... The CMANO data only goes back to 1977, so I must have used actual Vietnam era radar ranges for the F-4s in the Vietnam and pre 1977 lists. If you can find any info on radar ranges for F-4s in the 80s and 90s, I'd gladly incorporate the correct ranges into the rules. I think for a mid-80s Red Storm Rising game, you could use the increased radar range of 24" for F-4s / F-4Gs, so they would look the same as the Gulf War list, sans the 20mm cannon for the F-4G For the F-111, I can easily add it to the Gulf War list - I'd probably go for the following for mid 1980s F-111s - let me know what you think: Hope that helps!
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Post by themodernwargamer on Aug 7, 2022 6:56:56 GMT
Thanks for the fast response.
WW3 was a setting I gamed a lot in the late eighties and early nineties and it was recently seeing dramatisations of some of the actions from Red Storm Rising on YouTube that has inspired me to revisit it.
Thanks also for the link to the database as my “primary” source is currently the Data Annex for GDW’s version of Larry Bond’s Harpoon rules, which was published in 1990! However, it does confirm the 27nm/16” range for the APQ-120 radar on the F-4E against a small target and also the 40nm/20” radar range for the F-16, so maybe that 111km range is indeed overestimated?
The F-111 data looks good, but, also regarding F-111 variants, shouldn’t the EF-111 Raven be ECM(X) as it has essentially the same ALQ-99 escort jamming suite as the E-6B Prowler?
I will now get back to painting the aircraft.
Regards
Peter
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Post by NKL AeroTom on Aug 18, 2022 23:43:10 GMT
Hi Peter - sorry for the late response, must have missed the notification for this.
Can easily amend the EF-111 to be ECM(X), would just increase the points value by 2.
Would love to hear how your games get on!
Tom
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